Aggies to SECede?
Posted by Brett Kincaid on August 9, 2011
Multiple sources in Texas tell me today that a deal to allow Texas A&M to join the SEC has been agreed to in principle. An additional source – unconfirmed at the moment but typically reliable – tells me all 12 conference members have voted unanimously to accept A&M into the league. Speculation out of Texas has the Aggies playing football in the SEC during the 2012 season, not in 2013 or 2014 as I first heard.
We’ll update as rumors are confirmed or denied. If this is all true, it tracks with information I was given late last week that a deal between Texas A&M and the SEC was imminent.
More later…
FOR THE RECORD: It needs to be understood that we are not journalists. Adam, Jeff, and I work on this blog part time, typically during lunch breaks and at night. Unless we specifically say otherwise, please understand that we are “talking out loud” as we track down stories and send/receive information from our sources and journalist friends.
UPDATE I: I have a second source with ties to Aggie administration officials that confirms the Aggies and the SEC have been discussing a contract for membership. No one is willing/able to confirm that the deal is complete, though.
UPDATE II: The silence is deafening. Nothing new to update right now. Sorry. If I get anything else confirmed or new news that I’m allowed to share, you can bet I’ll put it up here.
UPDATE III: Billy Liucci (link to his Twitter feed) is all over this story from the Aggies perspective. I note two major reports from him:
Facts: Ags still hold SEC invite (always have), SEC will take A&M as 13th team and, IF deal done this month, TAMU would play in SEC in ’12More facts: A&M has not sent a “letter of intent” or “Dear John” letter to Big 12, SEC is not targeting OU or any other B12 schools
The second Tweet is particularly interesting because rumors this morning indicated that aTm had begun the official separation process. Thanks to Jack Hopkins at BobcatReport.com for sending me Billy’s Twitter feed.
UPDATE IV: Lots of rumors out there that we cannot confirm right now. They range from the Alabama AD Mal Moore restructuring their 2012 football schedule with Texas A&M included to Baylor looking for places to land. Nothing we can substantiate right now, and it may be impossible to confirm some of this. If you hear similar stories, though, let us know.
UPDATE V: Nothing new at the moment, but we are actively tracking a few leads. One Aggie reader suggests another person to follow on Twitter. David Sandhop publishes the Aggie Websider and shares a good deal of info on his Twitter page.
Hearing from sources that formal invite document from SEC is being drafted.
UPDATE VI: Looks like everyone needs to simmer down and settle in for the long haul. I’ve been led to believe this is indeed happening. It’s a major move by both sides, so the terms of the deal will be thoroughly reviewed. There does appear to be some validity to the notion that both aTm and the SEC are negotiating when the Aggies would start play in football.
As I mentioned earlier, check out David Sandhop on Twitter. He appears to be on point with what I have heard today.
@HopWebsiderThere’s probably nothing “imminent” today or this week. Right now, they’re just getting things in order
50 Responses to “Aggies to SECede?”
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Maukavelli said
Who’s the dance partner coming with ‘em? Missouri? West Virginia? Both plus the Florida schools? Can’t imagine just adding one, and if it’s just both Mizzou and A&M, who moves to east? Auburn makes the most sense geographically, but will the SEC split BAMA and the Burners?
Get ready for the rumor mill. Cause it’s about to start blowing smoke big time if this domino falls.
Anthony said
I think it has to be Clemson or GA Tech to keep the divisions aligned.
Brett Kincaid said
I have heard that Slive is content to go 13 for the short-term. I don’t get the impression a 14th team will be announced right away. I could see a situation where Slive milks it, basically getting a team to BEG to be the 14th member.
I have also heard something that says the deal is contingent on a to-be-named ACC team (Clemson?), but I’ve only heard that once.
Obviously, all rumors right now with no one willing to go on the record yet.
Maukavelli said
To Anthony and BK’s comments about possibly Clemson, I just don’t get that. Nor GA Tech. This isn’t necessarily about geography anymore. This is about $ and televisions. Missouri makes sense for that (St. Louis and KC markets), with no real overlap with any other team. Clemson splits with USC-E. Tech splits with UGA. Same reason why FSU and Miami don’t really make any sense. W. Virginia (or even Virginia or Virginia Tech for that matter) bring something that the others don’t: new revenue streams.
I’m not saying it couldn’t be one of those teams; I just wonder what they bring to the table. I like your comment about milking it, though. Slive will totally try to do that.
Brett Kincaid said
I agree with you, Maukeavelli, about the TV sets. Missouri makes the most sense, and that has been the school most mentioned from my Aggie contacts. It’s all about new TV eyeballs, and that market makes a ton of sense.
I’d keep an eye on Virginia Tech, too. Brand new market with a football powerhouse that competes in other sports. If it is true that the conference is eyeing an ACC school, that makes a lot of sense.
CharlieWVU said
Guys, I agree that, in a vacuum VT makes sense. But when the ACC raided the Big East, VT wasnt in the ACC’s top three. The ACC wanted Miami, BC and Syracuse.
The governor of Virginia forced UVA to vote against expansion, which when added in with the other “nay” votes would have stopped expansion. VA’s Governor did not want VT being left behind in a depleted and financially troubled Big East. To get the VA Gov on board Swofford swapped the invite from SU to VT, and the rest is history.
Thus, it would stand to reason that VT and UVA are not going to be in different conferences, and VT absolutely would not be leaving UVA behind in a conference that barely makes more in TV with ESPN, than the offer that the Big East just turnded down from ESPN.
Kris "The Lowest Denominator" Boyd said
I’m curious as to why Maukeavelli thinks Miami does not make sense. I don’t see Miami leaving and joining the SEC, but with all that Miami has shown not to support its pro teams… they support the crap out of the Cains and Miami is a large TV market.
Chris M said
That’s just plain wrong on football attendance. Since 2004, when Miami averaged over 59k, the attendance has been: 45310(’05), 41908 (’06), 43589 (’07), 46299 (’08), 47551 (’09), and 51509 last year. Not exactly rushing in to see the Canes….
Kris "The Lowest Denominator" Boyd said
51,000 ain’t nothing to scoff over. Besides, this has nothing to do with butts in the seat. TV markets, my man, TV markets.
CharlieWVU said
There would be no contingent to you guys joining the SEC. I am a WVU fan, and would desperately want to join the SEC, and would love to be the 14th team.
But you guys are head and shoulders above everyone else on Slive’s wish list. I can guarantee you that no other team, be it WVU, Clemson, Mizzou, or whoever would have to also agree to join before the SEC would formally invite TAMU.
You guys are in the catbirds seat. The rest of us are just squirrels trying to get a nut.
John Pinson said
CharlieWVU, I’m sorry my fellow American but West Virginia split from Virginia and sided with the yankees during the war of northern aggression. If you think there is any chance that WVU makes it into the SEC then I have an energy replacement for coal to sell you. We’ll take our Texan bretheren over coal miners all day and forever. Yall need to stick with your backyard brawl and fellow coal miners Pittsburgh. I hate it for you because I live in Myrtle Beach and I think half of the state of WV moves and lives in SC. I will give you this. WV has some beautiful women.
John Pinson said
I hope you appreciate the intended humor Charlie.
Lynn said
Just to let you know- you made the Aggie Websider board.
Brett Kincaid said
Thanks for letting us know, Lynn.
Hopefully someone there can help us track down this story today. If anyone has tips/leads but doesn’t want to share them publicly, please email me at brettkincaid@yahoo.com.
Lynn said
Also on BamaMag. You’re blowing up the interwebs
Lynn said
The Lies of Texas made it on there too. World famous Blog Hawgs!
John from Deep East Texas said
I love my Aggies, but we have the vapors right now. When I start hearing more, solid SEC-side sources, I’ll perk up.
Brett Kincaid said
I tend to agree, John. We got damn close to a deal last year. In fact we ran with a story that it was done. In retrospect that was a terrible decision. We are being much more thorough this year before saying “It’s done.’
I will say, though, that we have a lot better and more confident sources this year. This looks like the real thing, but like you I’ll wait until I get someone from Birmingham to speak up, even off the record.
LR said
It would be CRAZY to add Clemson or Ga Tech. They add nothing to the pie….basically all the SEC teams would be taking less per team to add Clemson and Ga Tech. Clemson is in a small state, and that TV market is already covered by S. Carolina. Georgia takes care of the state…GaTech doesn’t have enough TV imprint and doesn’t bring a new market.
That leaves teams like Virginia Tech, Virginia, Missouri and the Oklahoma teams, but OU and Ok State probably aren’t interested like aTm..and they may be tied to each other. FSU might be something to think about, even though there is already a team in Florida, the state is huge and FSU has a lot more of a fanbase than GaTech.
As an SEC guy, I think Missouri is a good market, and it wouldn’t make the league “too hard”. If you add aTm AND OU or FSU or even VaTech….the league is almost too much of a death march.
Brett Kincaid said
The only upside I see to adding another power is that I think it accelerates a playoff system. If you add aTm and one of those other schools you mentioned other than Missouri, I don’t know how anyone could go unbeaten.
O.T.R said
I think most everyone can agree that part of what makes the SEC so great is the southern rivalries, and their ability to market those on a national scale. Adding in a Clemson, GT or FSU have natural rivalries with South Carolina, Georgia, Florida, Tennessee, etc. They’re a culture fit, more than a “market” fit.
Think about if you were to add “market” teams, but the games got less attractive. Those lesser games will continue to dillute the product on the field. Let’s not forget that the ACC added BC, Miami and VT when they expanded, with BC being for the Boston market, which has never really panned out.
Challenger7D said
I was thinking the same thing … er hoping the same thing being a Clemson Alum & Fan. We hate Tobacco Road as much as aTm hates the Longhorns. We have a rivalry with sc and had one with UGA till we stopped playing every year. Clemson is Auburn with a lake. Clemson is the school in the ACC that fits the SEC culture best. If an invite did come it would depend on if the idiots in academia would sign off on it. I’m hoping.
Kris "The Lowest Denominator" Boyd said
I all for TAMU coming to the SEC if it leads to more pics like the one attached to this story.
LMATX said
Facebook Chatter | https://www.facebook.com/TAMUtoSEC
Kris "The Lowest Denominator" Boyd said
I will add this Mr. Kincaid… I e-mailed my “predictions” from “The Lies of Texas” post to all of my OU and OSU friends (ranging from casual fans all the way up to large boosters with connections to Gov. Henry) and they see OU/OSU to the Big 10 like it has almost already happened. They are expecting A&M to jump to the SEC.
Adam Butler said
Not journalists? Speak for yourself.
*I* have a Journalism degree. So, I MUST me a journalist.
Hempstead Ag said
Believe the East team will be NC State and it may have some balking, be a hard sell.
Tom in Lazybrook said
I believe that Va Tech should be first in a Eastern raid on the ACC, but NC State is second. Apparently, UNC is absolutely not interested in the SEC without Duke. And Duke isn’t going to the SEC. But Oklahoma might make a move if TAMU does. If that happens, then perhaps the SEC chooses to go to 14 and shift Alabama and Auburn to the East. As an Auburn fan, our traditional rivals are mainly Eastern teams (Tennessee, Georgia, and Florida). Yea that brings the likely conference schedule to 9 games (6 in your division, 1 traditional rival from the other side, and 2 rotating) or stay at 8 games and keep only 1 rotating or drop the traditional rivalry game from the other division (Alabama and LSU is the only problematic intradivision rivalry in that case).
John Pinson said
Tom, I’m a Gamecock but I agree with your thoughts. I would rather expand west into Texas (A&M) and Oklahoma (Sooners). I agree with you that if we as a conference go that way I would support moving (geographically) Alabama and Auburn to the east. I wouldn’t mind taking NC State or VT but adding Okie and the Aggies regardless of the market share would give us a conference no one could touch. We would get the Texas market along with the sooner tradition as one of college football’s best. They both deserve to compete with the best.
Dan Breland said
I agree that the SEC is interestred in OU but they do not want Oklaohma State. That makes me think Missouri is the logical choice. As one poster said, Mizzou brings the Kansas City and St. Louis markets. In the east, I think West Virginia and NC State are the most likely choices. VT is joined at the hip with UVA and UNC will never leave the ACC. NC State gives the SEC the Charlotte and Raleigh/Durham television markets and that it what is driving conference expansion. I think as soon as Texas A&M makes a move, the dominoes will really start to fall.
Brett Kincaid said
I’d think NC State is more closely tied to UNC than Va Tech with UVA. Don’t know that, but it’s my guess.
Charlotte/Raleigh/Durham is a great market to enter, but I’m skeptical. Of course, I’m skeptical of it all right now. No one is talking anymore
EC said
East carolina fan here. i’d be willing to bet NCSU would jump in a heartbeat. they hate being under Duke & UNC’s thumb. I just hope something works out in the end for my Pirates.
Kris "The Lowest Denominator" Boyd said
I’m liking the NCSU talk….
Tom said
VT would leave uva in a heartbeat. Plus would bring TV market of DC and all of Virginia (Northern Va, Richmond, Va Beach).
Bleedgold said
Georgia Tech in the SEC….for those that don’t want to see it happen best be careful for the Big 10 coming in and landing a lucrative Atlanta market. GT may not be the huge fan base of many SEC teams, but it does bring in tradition and quality in many areas. Clemson and GT should be together whether the ACC, SEC of Big 10er.
GTfreak said
Ga Tech gives the SEC a monopoly on the 9th largest t.v. market. It shuts out the ACC. Anytime you have a monopoly on a market you’re value grows exponentially.
BwoT said
Is it possible that TAMU and the Okie schools are pulling a Houston Nutt? Whereby they complain about their problems with the Longhorn Network, much is made about them taking their toys and
going home. Yet, at the end of the day, they only used these threats as leverage.
I’m not buying the Okie schools going to the BiG 10 (the one with 12 teams). I don’t think the Big 10 would take them. And that’s not a dig at Okie schools. The BiG 10 wouldn’t take Arkansas either. They’re kinda snobby like that. And they talk funny.
As much as Mizzou would make sense in the SEC as far as revenue markets, they just seem really out of place. And it’s cold up there in the fall. Besides that, they talk funny.
TexAg_Will said
@HopWebsider just tweeted, “Sounds like the final point to work out is whether Texas A&M will begin play in the SEC in 2012 or 2013 #gigem”
Really hope it happens. If it does, I could see Slive letting the conference sit at 13 for a bit.
Mike said
I don’t think GT goes to the SEC except as a defensive move to keep the Big Ten out. There are huge numbers of Big Ten alumni in the ATL market, and the Big Ten network would love to add those TV sets to their imprint. Moreover, GT is an excellent academic research institution, which fits with the rest of the Big Ten’s profile. The SEC would be crazy to let that happen, as it would give the Big Ten recruiting leverage in the southeast (they could tell kids about their one game in Atlanta every other year, and more importantly that their kin will be able to watch them on the Big Ten network…now available locally). But, why should the SEC move except to keep the Big Ten out?
BwoT said
I can’t believe nobody has mentioned Arkansas State as a possibility? I hear the Jonesboro Outback Steakhouse is gonna be serving beer soon.
hb said
you all are going to get your asses kicked worse then before
Herbie said
Oklahoma or Okie Lite to the Big 10 won’t happen–media markets aren’t big enough, they’re both a package deal (lots of Cowbois in the state legislature thanks to T. Boones Pickens’ money), and both of them aren’t in the AAC.
Missouri to the SEC is their only play because they know they will get passed over again by the Big 10–half of Missouri belongs to the Big 10 footprint already (St. Louis/East MO), so the Big 10 isn’t getting much of a boost to their TV footprint. Kansas, if they can get away from Kansas State, can bring part of MO and most of KS,
For the SEC, they need to look to a school in a state that they aren’t in already to expand the TV footprint and that isn’t paired at the hip to another program in the same state. Maryland (already a future Big 10 expansion target) would be good in that it’s not a tough opponent, they bring the Baltimore and DC markets, and there’s no other school they’re beholden to in their state.
The question the SEC probably wants to answer now is if they’ll be satisfied with 14, as Oklahoma’s rumored golden parachute with the Pac-12 has them bringing four Big XII schools (T. Tech, Okie Lite, and OU, plus ?…) to make them a conference of 16. This is just as big, if not a bigger issue to tackle than aTm to the SEC.
Adam Butler said
Good take, Herbie.
Herbie said
Thanks–been following this for a few years now, if my namesake should tell you anything.
Also, folks need to remember that this isn’t just about adding schools–these conferences are looking primarily for ways to improve their television footprint. Anyone that suggests a school that is in the same state that the SEC already broadcasts just doesn’t get it.
That’s why A&M is so lucrative to the SEC–Texas recruiting, the Houston television market and half of San Antonio expand the SEC footprint substantially. Unless the SEC goes to 16, they’re looking for a one-off school to take that can go on their own that isn’t already in a SEC state. That’s why your list of “moving buddies” for A&M is going to likely be:
West Virginia
Maryland
Missouri
West Virginia is at a disadvantage because they don’t bring in any significant TV markets, and they’re not a national brand.
Maryland brings in Baltimore and DC, which are good-to-great TV markets.
Missouri can bring the K.C. and St. Louis markets, but only partially–lots of Kansas and K-State alum in K.C., and lots of Illinois alum in St. Louis. Plus, thanks to the 70s-90s, Nebraska owns a sizable chunk of Missouri as well–just look at the coverage given to Bubba Starling in the MO papers.
In the end, though, Missouri is contiguous to the SEC footprint and has been reported to be groveling for a SEC invite. Wouldn’t doubt the Tigers are A&M’s moving buddy in this, and the SEC stops at 14, even if the Pac-12 goes 16.
Joe said
Y’all are nuts. The following schools will NEVER receive and invitation to the SEC:
Florida State
Georgia Tech
Clemson
Louisville
Votes from Florida, South Carolina, Georgia, and Kentucky are enough to keep someone out, and what benefit would ANY of those schools receive from doing a major rival a favor?
Joe said
F$U would bring football and baseball.
Tech would bring… nothing.
Clemson would bring… baseball occasionally.
Louisville would bring basketball.
There just isn’t enough benefit to the conference, and especially the rival schools, to agree to an invite for them.
Probably the only time you’d ever see Florida and Georgia vote for the same thing.
NikeJacket said
Tech’s baseball program is on par if not ahead of FSU and Clemson’s. Tech also brings along 4 national championships in Football.
Regardless, if expansion is on the horizon, the SEC would be smart to expand outward as well as secure their footprint.
The possibility of the Big 10 or any other conference coming into the South (especially Atlanta) would negate any potential gain from adding Tamu or any other team.
Clemson-Auburn, Clemson-Uga, Tech-Bama. Tech-Auburn, Tech-Tennessee, FSU-Florida, Louisville-UK, etc. are already built in rivalries.
It would also make sense in a 9 game conference schedule to add current OOC rivalry teams.
A game like Boise-Uga or never happens if they had to place 9 SEC games + Tech.